Monday, August 08, 2005

Do we need God?

Do we need God? I am not a religious person, and I used to be almost hostile of Christianity. My views have slowly softened quite a lot, especially after I started reading about Islam. I notice Christianity is spreading in China at a time the country is booming (the same for South Korea), and is weak in Europe, a continent and a civilization that seems to be on its deathbed. Tiny, Jewish Israel has managed to stave off repeated Islamic attacks for decades. I remember an article I posted before:

The Spiritual Malaise That Haunts Europe

Europe is depopulating itself in numbers greater than at any time since the Black Death of the 14th century. When an entire continent, healthier, wealthier and more secure than ever before, fails to create the human future in the most elemental sense — by creating the next generation — something serious is afoot. Demographic vacuums don't stay vacuums; they get filled — in Europe's case, by Islamic immigrants. Europe's effort to create a tolerant, civil, democratic civilization by cutting itself off from one of that civilization's sources — Jewish and Christian convictions about the dignity of the person — is likely to fail.

Is our lack of religion the reason for our indecisiveness and difficulty in seeing right from wrong?


At August 08, 2005 9:08 PM, Blogger Baron Bodissey said...

European countries have generally had "official" Christian religions, maintained and funded by the state. This means that when people lose respect for the state, religion suffers, too. When I lived in England many years ago I noticed the contempt with which the average person viewed the Church of England.

In America, Christianity remains strong because of its separation from the state. And Christianity in China, of course, is the enemy of the dictatorial regime, which helps it to flourish.

At August 08, 2005 11:23 PM, Blogger sissyblue said...

Wow, I think you'll get hundreds of comments on this one!

A better question is "Does God Exist?" Do we think that the Universe, which has a beginning, just popped into existance from nothing, or was there a Creator? That's the BIG question. If there is a Creator, has this God made contact with us? What does this God want from us? These are REALLY important questions if we believe there is an entity which is powerful enough to create the universe.

Personally, I was spiritually re-awakened after 9-11. I started examining questions like these, and studying various religions, to make sure the one I was raised with was correct (Christianity). I purposely looked for errors. I pretended I was a Jew (for example) and read the OT to see whether it folded together with Christianity. I'm kind of rattling on.

I NEED God. If I was absolutely certain there was no God, I would kill myself rather than continue. "For who would bear the whips and scorns of time, the oppressor's wrong, the proud man's contumely, the pangs of despised love, the law's delay, the insolence of office and the spurns that patient merit of the unworthy takes, when he himself might his quietus make with a bare bodkin?" ~ Hamlet.

Maybe that's why the "west" is chosing death. They no longer believe there's a higher power to answer to, and to help when they're in deep distress.

Yes, I need God, and when I found God, I knew what true love was.

At August 09, 2005 1:28 AM, Blogger Runnymede1215 said...

No, I can't see any importance in religion, the fact that you and most other sensible people aren't aggressive about christianity anymore is simply because it's becoming less threatening and less important in society.

I guess one of the biggest reasons we europeans don't procreate as we should, and certainly would like to, is that our societies are designed to create the maximum amount of taxes for our governements, so they can continue bribing us with our own money, and support "the poor" as our leftist media demands.

Once such policies have affected the demographic profile so that most people are old or middle age, the older groups in society have so much "voting power" that any changes inte the tax pressure becomes even more difficult, and the young people who could raise families have to wait even more, just to keep working to pay for other peoples pensions.

The high taxes also destroys the possibility for most young professionals to hire competent household help to cope with family and professional life.

When you work and make money, it's your money, not the governement's

Just let people keep their money, I would strongly suspect that most of them would use it to raise healthy families. After all, that's the way evolution is supposed to work.

Please visit Forum mot Islamisering, a swedish forum against islamization

At August 09, 2005 1:43 AM, Blogger PD111 said...

baron bodissey:

The Anglican church is foundering in a sea of PC. It has lost its moorings. OTH, evangelical churches are doing just fine, have large congregations and attracting more and more poeple.

Fjordman posed the question,"Do we need God?"

For what purpose? If it is for a political or social purpose, then we are in the real danger of looking for miracles. The answers to such problems are in our hands. God's presence in our hearts may help our troubled hearts and minds but the decisions are with us.


At August 09, 2005 1:49 AM, Blogger Fjordman said...

DP111: I meant as something you are willing to believe in and fight for. I'm not sure I need it. Fighting for the freedom of my children is enough. But I do see that maybe our spirits have become weakened by abandoning religion.

At August 09, 2005 2:01 AM, Blogger Baron Bodissey said...

DP111 -- you've hung around Gates of Vienna enough, so you may well know how Dymphna and I feel about the Anglican/Episcopal church.

My own personal limit is that I will leave it if (when) it votes to divest from Israel. That will be the final straw. It will not change my religious beliefs, but I will no longer in good conscience be able to send my money to ECUSA.

At August 09, 2005 2:21 AM, Blogger sissyblue said...

The Creator of the universe would not need the help of mere mortals to help fight His battles (oops, I'm not being PC by assigning gender)!

I think that's why I was fairly certain Islam was not correct. Only a weak, false god would think it's okay to kill in his name, and also the thing about killing people who "leave the religion" is pretty indicative of a weakling, false god.

At August 09, 2005 3:09 AM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

You are probably correct Fjordman. Wether or not the gods exist in reality does not matter.Unfortunalty, god concepts are turned to at the first signs of downfall of a civilization.This happened in Rome, and is happening in Europe now...

Most of the people who fight Illegal Immigration come from a more religious demographic in the USA. Republicans are divided between Country Club Repubs, and Conservative Christian Repubs. So we are relying on the poorer conservative base to get the ball rolling on Illegal Immigration...
(VDARE.COM )etc..
If you stay in touch with American Immigration issues, you can see what works, and what doesnt..
As Norway in general has the lowest level of Religous people in Western Europe, one can argue you guys are in big trouble...

At August 09, 2005 3:13 AM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

"oops, I'm not being PC by assigning gender"

Nope, but a Female god means an earth goddess, not sky god, which is half the problem....

One cannot dominate "other" (Islam ic) male gods with a female goddess religion...

At August 09, 2005 3:28 AM, Blogger sissyblue said...

Is it just me, or does the Bad Monkey make no sense?

At August 09, 2005 3:38 AM, Blogger sissyblue said...

Sorry, for some reason my comment was entered twice, so I deleted one comment.

I really must disagree with the Bad Monkey. I think Norway is way ahead of the game, as usual. Norway was not stupid enough to join the EU. Norway stood fast in opposing Hitler, and fighting with a strong underground. Norway "discovered" North America. Norway will survive. I am sad though if it's true that Norway is the lowest in recognizing the existence of God. That makes me very sad, being of Norwegian ethnic origin.

At August 09, 2005 5:15 AM, Blogger Thomas the Wraith said...

Question: Is our lack of religion the reason for our indecisiveness and difficulty in seeing right from wrong?

Answer: Yes.

At August 09, 2005 10:18 AM, Blogger Rev Sam said...

The conflict is undoubtedly a spiritual one, and one of the things which the <Islamists gain strength from is our perceived spiritual malaise. This war won't be won with guns (at least, not with guns alone).

So yes, I think we need God. But you might expect me to say that :O)

At August 09, 2005 11:54 PM, Blogger PD111 said...

baron B
I dont know how you and Dymphna feel about the Anglican church. I hope I didnt hurt anyone's feelings. Apologies if so.

I was brought up in the Anglican church but have since migrated to a more "dynamic" church.

I talked to my pastor about the current difficulties we all are in. His response was as I expected - follow the example of Jesus.

Fighting for our children's future is good. Fighting because our cause is just and right, is good as well. Besides Islam has no future. Even if we disregard that islamic ideology is just about loot and plunder and nothing else, or disregard the social values of Western civilisation, just the advances of science and technology, will make islam irrelevant in a 100 years or less.

You know sometimes I feel that this whole war that islam has declared on us, is a bad dream. How can the most advanced and powerful civilisation in history be so damned gullible? I expect to wake up anytime soon and find that all is well and it is a dream afterall.

At August 10, 2005 12:33 AM, Blogger sissyblue said...

PD111, I think you're underestimating the danger posed by Islam. The Koran justifies all their abhorent behavior. At least when Christians have behaved badly (Inquisition) they were not justified by the Bible. It is an inescapable fact that they look upon anyone outside Islam as sub-human. You can read it in the Koran, and you can see it in the countries where they are the majority. It's not a bad dream. It's reality.

The Koran also says to "lay low" until you are the majority and then take over. I wish more people would read the Koran, so they'd know what they're up against. I wish people would have read Mein Kampf in 1925, we could have all been better prepared.

I guess it goes without saying, I wish everyone would read the Bible also, with that same idea of "preparation" in mind.

:>) S

At August 10, 2005 2:50 AM, Blogger PD111 said...

sissyblue posted : I think you're underestimating the danger posed by Islam

No fear of that. I read the koran around May-June 1967, and immediately realised what an evil/vile creed it was. I have no intention of sullying my mind once again.
From around 1980 onwards I have warned any who would listen of the dangers posed by allowing muslims into the West. I was listened with polite amusement. I predicted that Freedom of expression would be under threat - and so it has turned out. The Rushdie affair was the first danger flag of that. I also predicted that terrorism would start in the West once the muslim population reached a critical mass. I could see no reason why the West would be an exception to what has been the rule since the 7th century.

Fjordman knows me from LGF since 9/11, where I started to post within a month after 9/11, and I dont think he will agree with you that I have any illusions of islam.

Quite frankly, it is really our fault for this Jihad. The Jihad has been invigorated here, mainly because we allowed muslims to immigrate to the West. Their children, born here, are now emboldened by that fact, ie they are supremely confident that they cannot be deported. The worse that could happen to them, is that are sent to jail, where of course they can continue their dawa, and harm the kuffar economy to boot. Saudi money has only played a minor part.

As far as the muslim world is concerned, the jihad is not their fault. They have openly made their intentions clear and continue to do so. I agree. If we didnt realise that Jihadi terrorism would come to the West as a consequence of allowing muslims in, then it is our ignorance that is to blame.

This war is now reaching a critical phase. The truth about Islam is coming out, and consequently Taqqiya and kitman will be on full blast. Always bear in mind that the active jihadis and the passive jihadis(the moderates), work in concert, each in their own task to further the cause of islam. The jihadis provide the big booms of the orchestra while the moderates, the siren song of the violins. They do not need any formal agreements to do this; it is understood by both parties. Hasnt anyone noticed that demands from muslims increase after each act of mass terrorism? Therefore the greatest danger comes from the so called moderate muslims, as they are the ones who are most active in Taqqiya and getting sspecial privelages for islam. The Bakris and Hamzas in fact are actually on our side, as they tell us the truth about their intentions.

I'm now content that the truth about islam has come out. Islam the ideology, is not going to have its own way anymore on the basis of the ignorance of the infidel world about islam.

At August 10, 2005 3:07 PM, Blogger sissyblue said...

pd111, I agree with everything you said except "As far as the muslim world is concerned, the jihad is not their fault. They have openly made their intentions clear and continue to do so." The jihad is their fault. It's continuance is their fault.

There was a song in 1969 called "One Tin Soldier", which reminds me of what's happening to the west.

I'm also reminded of a friend who found a little coyote pup. It's mother had been hit by a car. He took the pup home and tried to raise it. It never became domesticated, and was always fearful and vicious with him. Finally he had to let it go because it was becoming to big and dangerous (this was in the olden days before animal rescue facilities and he was living in Washington in the mountains). My point is, we've taken some coyotes in, thinking they would be like our dear pet Spot.


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