Sunday, July 31, 2005

The way of the ostrich

Much as we may wish to ignore it, the reality is that ours has become a very violent country, full of lethal militias and vicious, hate-filled ideologies. Now, a Pakistani-looking passenger will inevitably draw suspicious glances whenever he boards a train or a bus. Consider this e-mail I received recently from Steve Cribbs: “...I am a 47-year old, working class, white Englishman, who frequently works in London. I’ve always considered myself to be a moderate man and this series of events ... is extremely worrying. Recently I have heard Afro-Caribbean immigrants demanding that all Muslims be sent back (even those born here!). I don’t feel that’s fair but have grave concerns that our cultures are mutually incompatible. We feel like we have taken in a nest of vipers. We feel betrayed by immigrants who have come here to our homeland who consider us as corrupt and immoral. Our women are branded as whores. Some immigrants say we are not fit to govern our own country and that they seek to make Britain a Muslim state."

I am reproducing excerpts from another e-mail, this time from a Pakistani reader living in the United States: “... a lawyer [of Pakistani descent] at the Justice Department ...informed us that ... more and more mosques are telling people present for prayers that ‘we need to have separate schools so that we could protect our children from American culture’... Finally, wherever we go, Muslims in general and Pakistanis in particular, we create and spread hatred, nothing else. I fear for the time when Christians, Jews and Hindus will put the rest of the work on hold and focus their undivided attention on eliminating terrorism around the globe. We cannot comprehend what will happen, but I guess that’s the only way out.”


At July 31, 2005 7:37 PM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

Looking at little green footballs, they have a few reports about Muslim Clerics saying they will not convert to christianity, IE: Moderate thier religion.
Why should they convert to christianity? That is what people want them to do, is to change themselves into christians. They are MUSLIMS.

Muslims have higher testosterone. Thats why they are SO CONSERVATIVE. Liberalism would DESTROY THEM. They NEED to hide thier women, or they GO SEX CRAZY. As MUSLIM CLERICS HAVE STATED THIS OPENLY.
(Where are the white Liberals to tell us that all muslims are christians????)

The INTELLECTUAL WAR HAS BEEN WON... Where are the racist "everyone is white and civilized" DIV-ersity DIV-ide "Liberals" now?

At July 31, 2005 9:18 PM, Blogger Fjordman said...

You're still not making a lot of sense......

At July 31, 2005 11:33 PM, Blogger Jude the Obscure said...

How do you measure testosterone levels?

At August 01, 2005 12:20 AM, Blogger PD111 said...

This is the second article that I have read from the muslim world, bemoaning the catastrophe that may fall on the islamic world.

The first article was from Saudi Arabia.

The Muslim mind on fire.

Here is an except
The only accomplishment of jihadis is that now they have aroused the great "Western Tiger". There was a time when the United States and Europe welcomed Arab and Muslim immigrants, visitors and students, with open arms. London even allowed all dissidents escaping their countries to preach against those countries under the guise of political refugees.

Well, that is all over now. Time has become for the big Western vengeance.

Visas for Arab and Muslim young men will be impossible to get for the United States and Western Europe. Those working there will be expelled if they are illegal, and harassed even if their papers are in order.

Airlines will have to right to refuse boarding to passengers if their names even resemble names on a prohibited list on all flights heading to Europe and the United States.
As in the Saudi article, the main concern is for islam the ideology rather then the good of humanity, as this bit shows

I fear for the time when Christians, Jews and Hindus will put the rest of the work on hold and focus their undivided attention on eliminating terrorism around the globe. We cannot comprehend what will happen, but I guess that’s the only way out.

The most potent weapons we have against Islam/Jihad, are immigration and deportation. There is no doubt of that. The question is, how to use these weapons in a way that it does not create a schism in our society of such a magnitude, that it derails all anti-islamic measures. That would be a victory for the Jihad.


At August 01, 2005 12:31 AM, Blogger PD111 said...

One of the reasons that the MSM is not listening (one of the proverbial deaf monkeys pictured on The Gates of Vienna site), is that they are overwhelmingly liberal and secular. The Jihad though is a religious war, and for our MSM to acknowledge that such a war was in progress against us, would bring down their whole world. It is as if we the Bloggers, and the MSM are on completely different wavelengths. In other words, we have to shift our grounds or else we sound like bigots.

The MSM, BBC etc, will listen only if we Bloggers, couched our debate on secular terms.

Another reason to shift the battleground from the religious to the secular, is that this battleground suits Islam perfectly, as it further raises the profile of islam in the West, which is the main purpose of the Jihad. The secular battleground though is totally unsuitable to islam.

I feel that as long as we persist in battling on quasi-religious grounds, we fight on islam's preferred territory. No good at all.

On modern social grounds, there is much that is wrong with islam, and above all its practises, that a good case can be made to have the practise of islam made illegal in the public square. It is of course perfectly acceptable for anyone to read the koran or practice islam in privacy. That is a freedom that all should have.

Note: Islam cannot be just a private religion. It has to be political and public in its manifestation. If it cannot be public, it dies. But that is islam's problem.


At August 01, 2005 12:51 AM, Blogger Fjordman said...

pd111: I sometimes wonder whether Ali Sina is right about this. Islamic culture is based on shame. The key to winning is by shaming and humiliating them:

Combat Stupidity with Humiliation

By Ali Sina

At August 01, 2005 1:57 AM, Blogger Don Miguel said...

"Note: Islam cannot be just a private religion. It has to be political and public in its manifestation."

As far as I'm concerned, in Islam religion and politics are the same thing. That is why it is incompatible with democracy and will never be reformed (at least from within).

At August 01, 2005 2:08 AM, Blogger PD111 said...


Ali Sena is an indispensable ally in the battle against islam. No doubt of it. However, I feel that it is time to move away from attacking islam the religion, or even islam the ideology that wishes to conquer the world and subject all to sharia. This is still very much on the battleground that is suited to islam.

What I'm thinking is to concentrate our fire on the practice of islam in public that offends modernity. In other words, move the battleground to the secular field rather then continually hammer away, that muhammed was a paedophile, he was a slave maker and owner, or he was a thief and briggand. It serves no use anymore. I believe that Jefferson also kept slaves. Besides Muhammed is long dead, and so is Jefferson. No point in attacking dead people.

Now for the ideology that is in the koran It is true that the koran is full of the most vile injunctions against the non-muslim as well as those muslims who wish to stray away from islam, but if we use these arguments, I have noticed that muslims and the MSM, immediately bring up the argument, that the Bible also has violent passages. A kind of equivalence is thus established. Our attacks on the koran is the equivalent of the muslims attacking the Satanic Verses.

As you know I have written several times that "Muslims are the first victims of islam". I had not realised though the significance of what I had oft repeated.

Islam is a religion that forcibly converted others at the point of a sword, can be justifiably regarded as a slave organisation and ideology, as it forced other people to adopt a way of life against their wishes. Virtually all muslims in the world are descendents of those poor people, and are thus born into the world of slavery, with no hope of leaving it without dire consequences. Even if they escaped, they had to leave behind their family, friends and culture. It is tough for Ali Sena, Ibn Warraq and others such, and is an additional deterrent to any who would like to scale over the POW camp that is islam. (Islam wages war to make slaves and those who do not submit, are killed)

Over a thousand years this institution of slavery has developed its own culture that we now know as the religion of islam. It is of course our duty to rid this world of slavery.

Even in this slave culture, there are some slaves who are more equal then others. Women are at the bottom of the pile and this position is signified by the burqa.

Now I have nothing against a woman wearing a burqa in the privacy of her home, or in the course of a "rag" event or some such. What bothers me is that, we as a society have recognised the institutionalised slavery of women in islam, as legitimate in the West. This is absolutely absurd. It is a tragedy that we have allowed in, into the domain of Freedom, a society that practices slavery, and worse we give it legitimacy under the guise of multiculturalism.

Women in this slave culture, are the lowest in the social scale. The enslavement of women in islam should be our main concern, particularly muslim women in the West, as it is the easiest target. Freeing muslim women from slavery can never be regarded as a bigotted enterprise - far from it. It also strikes a hammer blow against islam the ideology - while we vehemently deny that we are attacking islam. Those muslims who do not wish to see their girls become Westernised will leave. This immediately alleviates the major part, if not all the jihadi problem. The remainder will have to deal with the implications for the koran. It is not our business.

The advantage of this method is that we deck ourselves in the garb of Freedom, morality, and above all, compassion against cruel injustice inflicted on the weak. No reference to islam or the koran is required.


At August 01, 2005 3:03 AM, Blogger Jude the Obscure said...

pd111/DP111 - very good points about moving criticism of Islamism into the secular area and attacking the moral relativity practised. Definitely the burka should not be permitted in western societies under any guise of 'freedom of religion' and should be equated with female circumcision and infibulation. Suttee was eradicated even though part of a culture. Equal rights for women would also shift Sharia law into another dimension as women move into public life and have a say in legislation.

At August 01, 2005 6:05 AM, Blogger Kifaya said...

"...deck ourselves in the garb of Freedom, morality, and above all, compassion against cruel injustice inflicted on the weak. No reference to islam or the koran is required."

Yes, exactly. That is how I see this conflict.

Of course, that is not to say the west does not have more work to do on the issues of freedom, rights, or voluntary servitude to capitalist forces...but, i digress.

But, really folks...public stoning and embarrassment for any woman gang raped by a bunch of thugs? Pu'leaz

At August 01, 2005 7:25 AM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

1."You're still not making a lot of sense......"

1A- A "Moderate" Mulsim would be a "Christian", IE: you dont support, and your cousins , etc dont support suicide bombing, martrydom, etc...

Martyrdom in Christianity was when the STATE KILLED YOU for your religious believes.
The Muslims believe they can be self appointed MARTYRS by KILLING OTHERS...

Being very "manly", Muslims do not hide their beliefs.They think they are superior in the first place, so they say what they are all about. They do not try to scam any of us, for the most part. They tell it like it is.

They hide THEIR women in beehives, because women walking around with legs showing, etc, would drive them nuts. (see LGF SITE)
They are a male dominated society, like all other societies. I dont have a problem with their behavior, as it is a natural occurance. As many aspects are geneticly inherited, that is why you dont want sooooooo many in your country...not at this day and age of science and understanding about human behavior....

When a MUSLIM CLERIC declares that women need the burka so mulsim men dont go SEX CRAZY looking at them, you have just WON THE ARGUMENT....

2"How do you measure testosterone levels?"

2a. Testosterone levels? - There is a good article on this now at VDARE. I dont know how you measure testosterone, probably the same way you measure ANY OTHER CHEMICAL IN THE HUMAN BODY......

I take alot for granted when I post. Sorry Im so broad...

At August 01, 2005 7:35 AM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

Let me repeat that because its sooo important, THE most important thing you'll ever read about muslims...:

"When a MUSLIM CLERIC declares that women need the burka so mulsim men dont go SEX CRAZY looking at them, you have just WON THE ARGUMENT.... "

This ends the argument...What they are saying, the muslim clerics (we WILL NOT MODERATE) etc..ENDS THE ARGUMENT....
No Liberal can argue with the reality of the Muslim. Its over...
Anyone who wants less immigration just has to call them out. (Press please??)They will not fiddle around with the truth for the most part...

As I have been saying, its the muslims who will make the decisions, not anyone in the West. The West can ONLY react...
Please think about that, and scan the LGF site.......

At August 01, 2005 8:26 AM, Blogger ik said...

1. For some reason there seems to be very little discussion in the West of reducing the amount of money going to Saudi Arabia. Money is one of the pillars of Jihad. Every Windmill/solar cell/hydrogen/CNG vehicle set up is less money going to the middle east. There must be a way for the Western right to align with sensible elements of the environmentalists (if there are any!) to move aggressively away from oil.

2. All over East Asia all the countries protest vigorously whenever the Japanese try to whitewash their history books. I do not understand why nobody questions and protests against the History books in islamic countries. Cleaning up the history books in Islamic countries would also reduce the future production of Jihadis/Islamic Supremacists.

At August 01, 2005 3:31 PM, Blogger erp said...

Seven hundred generations of evolution have bred aggressive moronic men for Islam. This natural selection went so fast because Islam gives the worst of its adherents virtually unlimited access to baby producers. Men are encouraged to have as many wives as they can support, and raping infidels and slaves has vastly increased the progeny of Muslim's finest sadists for Allah.

Intelligence was bred out because Allah doesn't want thinking men, only mindless ones, like the Borg, they've been programmed to kill.

At August 01, 2005 7:59 PM, Blogger Don Miguel said...

From Kyle Reese in "The Terminator":

"Listen. And understand. That terminator is out there. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead."

Changing "terminator" to "Islamofascist" in the previous quote seems pretty apt.

But, I also like what Erp said:

"... like the Borg, they've been programmed to kill."

At August 01, 2005 9:19 PM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

Oh, erp...I think I love you...!


At August 01, 2005 9:30 PM, Blogger ThBadMonkey said...

Actually, in all asian countries, suicide is a well accepted form of warfare. Only in the west does super individualism, and superiority to nature supercede this rergessive concpet.Even Russian pilots are trained to used suicidal take out tactics (one for one) if it comes down to the line...

At August 01, 2005 11:01 PM, Blogger PD111 said...

erp posted: Intelligence was bred out because Allah doesn't want thinking men, only mindless ones, like the Borg, they've been programmed to kill.

Then that should make our task easier.

I'm beginning to see the chinks in islam, as I read some of the self-flagelleting articles from the islamic world. They are thrashing around, pitying themselves and blaming the West in equal measure. This may well be the beginning of the end of islam as a culture as we know it now.

PS. I'm trying to move the battleground into the secular field, and trying not to mention the koran, islam or anyting of that sort. It is most important that we have compassion for those who we know are more to be pitied then censored.



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